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Topic: Free( Again)

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  1. #1
    Senior Member fastlane's Avatar
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    Free( Again)

    Hey, that sounds like a song about a felon! Ha,ha.

    I tried importing my Ignite Free .midi file into my DAW and using it's humanizing feature but it still didn't sound very human to me so I started a new version from scratch.

    Here's the instrument list.

    JABB

    Alto Sax
    Tenor Sax
    Fusion Drum Kit (5 instances)
    Bb Clarinet 1
    Bb Clarinet 2
    Bb Clarinet 3
    Accordion
    Jazz FrettedBass
    Electric Guitar

    GPO 4 Trumpet 1

    NI Kontakt Factory Library C3 Blues Organ(2 instances slow and fast Leslie)

    Here's the original Ignite rendered tune for a comparison.

    Free(Ignite)



    And here is the newest version.

    Free (Again)

  2. #2

    Re: Free( Again)

    Great post, Phil - comparing the two versions makes for very interesting listening.

    Naturally, your Garritan produced version is so far superior it's ridiculous. Sounds nice!

    I haven't toyed with Ignite yet, though I downloaded it when you posted it in General awhile back. Could you tell us more about what it was like working with it? I understand it has a set of GM-type instrument samples, but it's also a composition producing program, right? Did it provide the chord progression? Is the melody all from you, or did Ignite provide some of that too?

    The only thing I actually preferred in the original Ignite version was the more straight forward opening drum riff. Ignite is providing drum patterns for sure, right?

    Posts that do comparisons of various sorts are always interesting. Hope you can give us a bit more info on this one.

    Randy

  3. #3

    Re: Free( Again)

    Definitely hear the difference. Interesting ensemble choice-I like it. If there is one thought I had it would be to come off the ride cymbal occasionally to create a different dynamic. I like the comparison as well.

  4. #4
    Senior Member fastlane's Avatar
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    Re: Free( Again)

    Randy,

    I'm happy you liked the new version. It was a lot of fun to use the JABB instruments.

    I haven't toyed with Ignite yet, though I downloaded it when you posted it in General awhile back. Could you tell us more about what it was like working with it? I understand it has a set of GM-type instrument samples, but it's also a composition producing program, right? Did it provide the chord progression? Is the melody all from you, or did Ignite provide some of that too?
    Actually I didn't use any of the chord, looping tools and such. I just used the instruments with quantization and lines up the tracks as a song. I probably used Ignite exactly the opposite way that it was intended upon conception. That's probably why I had some stability issues with it. If you listen to the user demos on the A.I.R.>Ignite site you'll get a better idea of what it was intended for.

    In many ways I enjoyed using it but there were so many things I couldn't do with it very easily. You are forced to use quantizing which is pretty much a deal killer for me. Maybe for some projects I could do that but it's just not the way I usually work.

    I sent A.I.R. Support a message asking if it would be practical or even possible to allow free time sequencing like Apple's GarageBand has. GarageBand would be a great scratch pad for me as a Mac user but it only imports into Logic 9 which is a brilliant marketing strategy but I don't own Logic and would only switch to it if the next Logic version was a really stellar upgrade which I think is possible but probably not likely.

    The only thing I actually preferred in the original Ignite version was the more straight forward opening drum riff. Ignite is providing drum patterns for sure, right?
    Yes, that was the best part of the Ignite version of Free. There was little bit of a tribute there to the rock band Free with their hit song back in the late sixties, All Right Now which starts with a straight ahead drum beat. You could start it with just a snare hit but I thought I'd start it with a somewhat odd intro drum solo and sort of catch the listener off guard when the rest of the band comes in.




    Phil

  5. #5
    Senior Member fastlane's Avatar
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    Re: Free( Again)

    Quote Originally Posted by RichardMc View Post
    Definitely hear the difference. Interesting ensemble choice-I like it. If there is one thought I had it would be to come off the ride cymbal occasionally to create a different dynamic. I like the comparison as well.
    Glad you enjoyed the listens Richard.

    Yes, I also thought about doing something about the constant cymbal ride. I did throw in a double beat here and there but I guess it wasn't very noticeable. I rarely use a drum kit so I'm just sort of winging it. I'll go back and try and break it up a little.

    Thanks for the input.




    Phil

  6. #6

    Re: Free( Again)

    Hi Phil,

    Interesting post, the comparison. The second one does sound better to me, but because of the rhythmic irregularities (quantisation?), I still prefer the first one, although the synth trumpet stays too much in the back.

    Nice drum sound in the second version, good bass and lovely intro.

    Thanks Phil,

    Max

  7. #7
    Senior Member fastlane's Avatar
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    Re: Free( Again)

    Max,

    Thanks for listening to both versions.

    The second one does sound better to me, but because of the rhythmic irregularities (quantisation?), I still prefer the first one
    I'll have to go back over the drum track and see if I can shore up the timing on it also.

    The Ignite version is the one that is quantized which means that it was played in to the beat of the digital metronome that results in a stiff mechanical time like the old drum machines. A human drummer or musician is actually speeding up and slowing down in the slightest way or pushing the beat hence the term "humanizing" a quantized midi track.

    I appreciate the input.

    PS

    Many years ago I did a single using a drum box and considered it , like politicians, a necessary evil at the time.

    Phil

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